This is ABSOLUTELY ridiculous

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This is ABSOLUTELY ridiculous

Postby tamra » Sat, 11 Sep 2004 09:11:05

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5962760/

I don't think this is right after they sacrificed a lot to go over there. at most, a slap on the wrist, desk duty for a short amount of time with their fellow soldiers still there to support them. and then when the smoke clears, move on!

there's far worse prison attrocities w/in US prisons. is our government saying the lives of Iraqi's (to save face with the people we're chasing for $$) are more valuable than our own american lives?

this was a bad outcome and to me nothing accomplished except to penalize the same people we forced to go over there on a hidden agenda. and that military discharge will follow them for the rest of their lives. and for what? people that wouldn't have thought twice about blowing them up in a heart beat?

The actual article in case it disappears one day:
Intel specialist pleads guilty to Iraq abuse
Sentenced to 8 months confinement, reduction in rank, discharge
The Associated Press
Updated: 6:28 a.m. ET Sept. 11, 2004

BAGHDAD, Iraq - A U.S. Army specialist pleaded guilty Saturday to abusing inmates at Abu Ghraib prison, the first Military Intelligence soldier to stand trial in the scandal that has so far focused prison guard reservists.

advertisementSpc. Armin J. Cruz, of Plano, Texas, was assigned to the 325th Military Intelligence Battalion at the grim facility on the western edge of Baghdad. He pleaded guilty to conspiracy and to maltreatment of prisoners.

The military judge, Col. James Pohl, sentenced Cruz to eight months confinement, reduction in rank and bad conduct discharge.

The prosecution alleged Cruz forced naked prisoners to crawl along the floor and later handcuffed the men together. Cruz would have received a year in prison. The 24-year-old soldier broke down in tears as he told the judge that the abuse occurred a month after a mortar attack killed his sergeant and another American soldier.

Defense attorney Stephen P. Karns argued that Cruz was suffering from post traumatic stress syndrome. Chief prosecutor Maj. Michael R. Holley said Cruz was not forced to take part in the abuse and that his actions contributed "to the tarnishing of the reputation and the image of U.S. forces."

Cruz became the second soldier convicted so far in the prison scandal, which broke last spring when CBS' "60 Minutes II" broadcast photos of Iraqi prisoners enduring sexual and other humiliation at the hands of grinning American guards.

In May, Spc. Jeremy C. Sivits pleaded guilty to four counts of abuse at his court-martial and was sentenced to a year in prison, reduction in rank and a bad conduct discharge.

Six other enlisted soldiers from the 372nd Military Police Company, an Army Reserve unit based in Cresaptown, Maryland, face charges in the scandal.

Following orders?
However, lawyers for the accused MPs have long contended that their clients were acting under instructions of intelligence agents and civilian contractors, who pushed them to "soften up" prisoners suspected of having information about attacks against Americans.

A probe conducted by Maj. Gen. George Fay focused on the role of the 205th Military Intelligence Brigade at Abu Ghraib, which oversaw interrogations at the grim facility northwest of Baghdad.

The report identified 27 people attached to the intelligence brigade -- both soldiers and contractors -- who are accused of complicity in the abuses, which were widely depicted in photographs that tarnished America's image worldwide.

The Fay report assessed the performance of commanders and senior staff officers higher up the chain of command and attributed the abuse to personal misconduct and, in some cases, confusion and inadequate supervision -- rather than orders from above or Pentagon policy.

Their findings followed an independent panel released a report blaming senior leaders, including U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and Joint Chiefs Chairman Gen. Richard Myers, for lax oversight of military-run prisons in Iraq.

The panel, led by former Defense Secretary James R. Schlesinger, found no policy of abuse and concluded that the problems were directly the fault of the soldiers who committed violence against the prisoners, and their immediate supervisors.
© 2004 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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Postby harddawg » Sun, 12 Sep 2004 17:51:11

not even sure myself why this happened like this. i understand they want to make a statement. but i think we need to think of our own first as not thinking about our own is what got us there in first place.
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Postby christy » Mon, 18 Oct 2004 19:42:32

Michael Moore has now written a book which contains letters from our troops. That will allow us to hear how they feel about this and a lot of other things.

I just saw that a group refused a mission because of unsafe vehicles. Damned if you do. Damned if you dont I guess.
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Postby RangerBob » Tue, 19 Oct 2004 00:10:03

Do NOT get me started on Michael Moore...

Wait, too late. That self-serving fatass has NO right to question our governmental activities in ANY way. You know what Michael Moore is? He's our generation's Hanoi Jane (huh... or John Kerry, now that I think about it).


:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:
If ya can't beat 'em - arrange to have 'em beaten...
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Postby kelly » Wed, 20 Oct 2004 10:47:39

Here is a latest plea. I just don't get it.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6287557/

You know :think: many soldiers volunteered to go after 9/11. That should have been thought about. Didn't this begin shortly after 7 soldiers were found & they were treated badly? I think 1 was Jessica Lynch. Who was made to pay for that? :?

If this is about saving face, we need to worry bout saving face with our troops & their family when we send them on suicide missions? I just read yesterday bout the faulty equip & dirty fuel which could make helicopters crash.
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